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To the Planet Edge 1999
July 18
September 23 |
At Toronto Andrew made fun of Americans; in the past he wasn't shy to criticize the country, the "ultraviolent Disneyland". Inspired by the comments Americans try to make sense of it all; read on. |
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American comments discussion
Written by S. Kennedy (limegreen44@yahoo.com)
for Dominion mailing list (an extract)
Olive Drab:
There were the usual sarcastic sounding things, a tirade during the intro of
Romeo Down worthy of Bono about Americans parking their bombs and tanks on our
doorstep, along with the question 'anyone here like Americans?' then leaning over
and cupping his ear to the assorted grumblings that came afterward.
Written by Todd C. Gregoire (tcg3@buffalo.edu)
for The Sisters of Mercy Tours site (an extract)
Romeo Down:
Eldritch: "Honk if you like the U.S.A."
Written by Stephen Cox (mish01@flash.net)
for Dominion mailing list
I am far from a flag-waving, face-painting, "U-S-A" chanting goon. But
despite my great love of the Sisters (see my review of the Boston
show) and tremendous respect for Eldritch's intelligence, I am
still disturbed and insulted by his compulsion to put down the US, as the
below suggests he did in Toronto. If he has such disdain for US, why is it
that he chooses to come here for 15 of 17 tour dates? He could sell far
more tickets on mainland Europe or his beloved Germany, no? For an artist
who has been silent for the better part of nine years, why does he choose to
express himself before those he criticizes?
At the very least, he should show some respect for the thousands of
Americans who, in the previous week, came out to show their loyalty and
support for him and his music. And the thousands more who will come out
over the next few weeks. And if he lacks that respect, I would rather he
have the balls to say it to our faces rather than waiting to get over the
border.
Of course, I will still gladly shell out $30 the next time he is in town...
:-)
Written by Tony Beck (tristren@earthling.net)
for Dominion mailing list
Stephen Cox:
Because there are people there who like the Sisters, and they should not be made
to suffer for the policies of the govt. :)
> At the very least, he should show some respect for the thousands of
It seems to me he has been treating his audiences excellently... (relatively
speaking)
> And if he lacks that respect, I would rather he have the balls to say it to
His quote to the Toronto audience was "Honk If You Love The U.S.A." then when
the audience responded with loud boos, he said "it's unanimous" then he reminded
us of all the US military might which is, as he put it "sitting on [our] lawn".
Not particularly defamatory....
Written by John Silva (jsilva@interlog.com)
for Dominion mailing list
Tony Beck:
This is not true, the audience did not boo when he said "Honk if you love
the USA", we did say anything.
He also did insult the Canadian crowd by saying "we were going to give out
our set list, but most of you can barely read".
Let's face it, Sisters is my favorite band, but this definitely wasn't my
best concert.
Written by George Carless (gcarless@pangeagroup.com)
for Dominion mailing list
Slagging off the Americans is an entirely British thing to do, and Eldritch
is very British. That doesn't stop him from associating with them, sleeping
with them, or taking their money. Since I'm an Englishman living in Chicago
with an American girlfriend and an American job, I can sympathize fully.
Written by Sarah James (minuit@erols.com)
for Dominion mailing list
Okay, let me get this straight in my mind...
The complaint seems to be that Andrew takes US dollars, then is critical of
Americans. I don't think there is a problem...
First, The Sisters of Mercy (Andrew Eldritch) write several albums which are implicitly and explicitly
critical of US policies and action. I doubt that anyone on this list, US citizen or not, agrees with all of
the screw-ups and idiocies perpetrated by the government. I also can't say that Americans as a whole
have the best reputation around the world. Beyond that, the Constitution allows folks the right to
speak their opinions. So he isn't a citizen. Are his opinions therefore invalid?
His comments are perfectly in line with previous attitudes that he has voiced. I see no inconsistency.
And if "Vision Thing" or "Floodland" has opened people's eyes to some of the lunacy or crap that the
US government has done, well, that's the kind of speech that the First Amendment was created to
protect. And the US government is only as good as the Americans who participate.
I agree with the points of view voiced by the Sisters. I support them by spending money on their
products and services. If he had stood on stage and retracted his previous points of view, I would be
disappointed by the hypocrisy, and consider him to be selling out - placing money above ideals...
Andrew's comments form a case of free market and First Amendment in perfect harmony.
Okay, I'll put my civics education back on the shelf...
Sarah
Written by Adam (nachtgeist@mindspring.com)
for Dominion mailing list
Sarah James:
... and isn't he just laughing all the way to the bank, as he can insult fans and they will still doggedly
throw their money at him. It can only re-enforce the impression that Americans are stupid...
Written by Jeremy Coffey (coffeyjt@hotmail.com)
for Dominion mailing list
My guess is he is "playing" to the crowd. In DC,
betwixt (iirc) Dominion/Mother Russia and Summer, he said "that was for the
republicans, this is for the democrats." While I couldn't say what percentage
of the crowd was partisan-minded, I thought it fitting nonetheless.
Prolly the same sort of thing in Toronto -- I'm sure it had more resonance than
Canada-bashing would have had in most of the US tour sites.
Written by Stephen Cox (mish01@flash.net)
for Dominion mailing list
Sarah James:
From the context of that remark I assume you mean political? Name five
specific political points of view voiced by the Sisters. Not vague "lunacy
or crap that the US government has done" (as you choose to express it), or
other non-specific anti-American sentiments. Specific points of view on
specific policies and actions of the United States and its government voiced
by the Sisters, i.e. AE. I have read all the interviews and am more than
familiar with all the lyrics. With few exceptions, AE is as vague as you
are. To suggest otherwise is an exercise in over-interpretation.
> If he had stood on stage and retracted his previous points of view,
(1) Based on what you write, what should be disappointing to you is that he
stood on the stage in America and said NOTHING about his "point of view";
and (2) Why would a person who for 20 years has been vocal in his disdain
for America choose to tour here virtually exclusively for 10 years, EXCEPT
for money? I have no problem with that; the man has made music that many
have bought and enjoyed, and he is entitled to profit by it (yeah for
capitalism!). But if he really is anti-American, then he is most certainly
placing money above ideals. [And the response "he's taking our money and
laughing at us" is particularly silly and doesn't lend much credibility to
whatever views you ascribe to AE, but rather makes them more shallow. Will
the Beastie Boys be performing in China anytime soon?]
Written by Eldritch60@aol.com
for Dominion mailing list
minuit@erols.com:
I have agree that some of our foreign policies are disagreeable. In the
forum of live musical performance I am sure it is easier to criticize "Those
Americans" than launch into a time-consuming, albeit accurate, discussion
properly addressing hairsplitting among factional lines.
Written by Paul (madder@icon.co.za)
for Dominion mailing list
Stephen Cox:
Errr.... but he hasn't, he doesn't like you lot.
Written by Patrik Lindell (qul006b@tninet.se)
for Dominion mailing list
Stephen Cox:
I don't know about that. He has certainly put down certain Americans, but not
the whole country (now we wouldn't have Stooges or Suicide et al if it wasn't
for American culture, would we). I think the America/Eldritch topic is more that
America obviously is the most extreme capitalist regime, and those extremities
sometimes tend to get rather absurd. And those absurdities Andrew loves to point
out. I think however, it is as much fascination for this than it is disdain
(in more or less the same way he has been talking about The Bomb). Whether
good or bad is not the question, the sometimes absurd way of living in the
western world is more what is at stakes if You ask me. The countries he has
really put down (and no, that does not apply to America) are France and Wales.
And he has not toured them!
I am sure the above sentence oversimplifies things, and should be
developed a bit more, but I did not have neither time nor energy to write
more right now.
Written by Robert Hedengren (rwednesday@bellsouth.net)
for Dominion mailing list
Okay, so now we know not to discuss the 'goth argument', the 'bootleg
argument', the 'drug reference argument'. Can we please add the
'Anti-American' argument. This is getting a bit tedious. Everyone has
good points, but no conclusion is going to be reached no matter. Every
audience has its good members as well as its band members. Every country
has its good points and its bad points. There is two sides to
everything, but we are not going to reach a unanimous decision on this
list. We all like different things about AE and the Sisters, and some
may even disagree with some of the finer points. But we are all here as
FANS for the man and his Music, can't that be enough?
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